Accounts Payable Questions

First, using SQL, I have been charged with getting the check register and certain fields have been required. I have a basic understanding of the AP System, I just want to find out if some of the transactions that happen in our system is custom, occurs in all JD Edwards Systems and I want to get a stronger understanding of certain transactions.

1. My understanding is that the AP Ledger is a mini-General Ledger, but shows everything that happens in AP. Voids show up in the F0414, but why don't they appear in F0411?


2. Similar to Voids not appearing in F0411, I wanted to know why Voids and the PO (void) Document Type doesn't appear in the General Ledger? I thought everytime something happened in the system, the General Ledger recorded it.


3. For Non Purchase Order payment, to find out what Department (MCU) and Account (OBJ) the money was charged too, this information can only be obtained by going to the General Ledger (GL Distribution). Is there a reason why this information wouldn't be in the AP System (customization) or does all JD Edwards AP Systems work this way?


4. What is the accepted way to join F0411 and F0911? Just joining on KCO, DCT and DOC, gives rise to Cartesian Products (many to many). Right now, this is the hardest part of my project to figure out as I don't know if you can get around Cartesian Products, especially when you have multiple line items and Accounting fixes mistakes on the fly and it gets recorded in the General Ledger.

I will continue to research this like I always do, just wanted to get some input from JDE List.

Thanks

Kenoh,

This is another one of those instances where you want a seasoned 'right hand man (or woman)'!

Most AP employees don't really know how the data interacts (I know this from my experience - your mileage may vary)... That said - don't trust the messenger! Find someone that really knows the data - and have them work with you.

Using Oracle is a good resource
Using a third party "INTEGRATOR" is a good resource
Using JDEList for the the details - is an excellent resource!

Opinions - even I have one...

(db)

Miguel,

Some answers to your questions. I hope they help.


[ QUOTE ]
1. My understanding is that the AP Ledger is a mini-General Ledger, but shows everything that happens in AP. Voids show up in the F0414, but why don't they appear in F0411?

[/ QUOTE ]

The AP Ledger, as a concept, shows everything that happens in creditors accounts, and is represented in the General Ledger by means of a single or multiple creditors control accounts. It would be a mistake to think of accounts payable or accounts receivable ledgers as mini general ledgers, as they are subsidiary ledgers (an accounting term as opposed to subsidiary ledgers as used in JDE) - showing finer or different detail on a more limited scope than the General Ledger.



[ QUOTE ]
2. Similar to Voids not appearing in F0411, I wanted to know why Voids and the PO (void) Document Type doesn't appear in the General Ledger? I thought everytime something happened in the system, the General Ledger recorded it.

[/ QUOTE ]

In JDE, the AP ledger is not confined to just the F0411 (payment vouchers - aka incoming invoices, debit notes, etc; including voids of these transactions). You also need the F0413 and F0414 for payments and payment detail including any voided payments. The F0401 should be included, not for financial detail. Information that is not contained in these tables is the expense detail or how the actual expenses (as opposed to the liabilities) are accounted for. This distribution to expense (or even asset or other) accounts is contained only in the F0911. The PO doc type is recorded in the F0911, but only in the bank/cash account. The other side of the entry is DCT AE (atomatic entry).



[ QUOTE ]
3. For Non Purchase Order payment, to find out what Department (MCU) and Account (OBJ) the money was charged too, this information can only be obtained by going to the General Ledger (GL Distribution). Is there a reason why this information wouldn't be in the AP System (customization) or does all JD Edwards AP Systems work this way?

[/ QUOTE ]

All JDE AP systems work this way. See answers to other questions for reasons.



[ QUOTE ]
4. What is the accepted way to join F0411 and F0911? Just joining on KCO, DCT and DOC, gives rise to Cartesian Products (many to many). Right now, this is the hardest part of my project to figure out as I don't know if you can get around Cartesian Products, especially when you have multiple line items and Accounting fixes mistakes on the fly and it gets recorded in the General Ledger.

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually it is CO, DCT and DOC, but it would be distinct combinations of them. A single payment voucher (DCT=PV) has a total value that is detailed in two different ways. The first way it is detailed is based on what the voucher is for (for example 200 widgets and 150 thing-a-ma-jigs). This detail is held in the F0411. The second way it is detailed is according to how the expense is accounted for. This detail is held in the F0911. There is not necesarily a one to one relationship between the voucher lines for a single voucher and the (generally expense, but can be other) accounts to which the total value of the voucher is distributed. The only requirement is the the total be the same. For example

Voucher Lines
001 widgets 50.00
002 thing-a-ma-jigs 75.00

Total 125.00

Distribution Lines
MCU: 123456789012 OBJ: 654321 25.00
MCU: 210987654321 OBJ: 654321 25.00
MCU: 111111222222 OBJ: 654321 25.00
MCU: 123123123123 OBJ: 654321 25.00
MCU: 555555555555 OBJ: 654321 25.00

Total 125.00

It may help to provide the accounting information for recording an AP transaction:

Purchase from XYZ limited:
General Ledger: Debit Expense account; credit Creditors Control account
Accoounts Payable Ledger: Credit XYZ limited

Pay XYZ limited:
General Ledger: Debit Creditors Control account; credit Cash account
Accoounts Payable Ledger: Dedit XYZ limited

Here is my take on your questions:

[ QUOTE ]
1. My understanding is that the AP Ledger is a mini-General Ledger, but shows everything that happens in AP. Voids show up in the F0414, but why don't they appear in F0411?

[/ QUOTE ]

There are two basic kinds of transactions in AP: Vouchers which are stored in F0411 and payments which are stored in F0413 and F0414. The PO document is a void payment and therefore is not stored in F0411.

[ QUOTE ]
2. Similar to Voids not appearing in F0411, I wanted to know why Voids and the PO (void) Document Type doesn't appear in the General Ledger? I thought everytime something happened in the system, the General Ledger recorded it.


[/ QUOTE ]

For void payments, you should see a positive posting to the cash account, and as Peter said, the offset to AP Trade will be a negative amount with an AE document type. Depending on your AP constants, this could be a summarized amount.

[ QUOTE ]
3. For Non Purchase Order payment, to find out what Department (MCU) and Account (OBJ) the money was charged too, this information can only be obtained by going to the General Ledger (GL Distribution). Is there a reason why this information wouldn't be in the AP System (customization) or does all JD Edwards AP Systems work this way?


[/ QUOTE ]

JDE records the gl distribution directly in the general ledger (F0911) for both AP vouchers and AR invoices. The cash entries in both systems are created by the GL Post Program.

[ QUOTE ]
4. What is the accepted way to join F0411 and F0911? Just joining on KCO, DCT and DOC, gives rise to Cartesian Products (many to many). Right now, this is the hardest part of my project to figure out as I don't know if you can get around Cartesian Products, especially when you have multiple line items and Accounting fixes mistakes on the fly and it gets recorded in the General Ledger.


[/ QUOTE ]

The keys to AP are Document Type, Document Number, Document Company and Pay Item. The keys to GL are Document Type, Document Number, Document Company and JE Line Number. There is no correspondence between Pay Item and JE Line Number as Peter clearly showed. (By the way, it gets even worse when Sales/Use/VAT taxes are included). In RDA JDE eliminates the cartesian product by using a subsection join and joining on level breaks as defined in the parent section. If AP is parent, sequence and level break on Document Type/Number/Company and mark all three for level break. The UBE will process all the pay items for a voucher, then join to the child section (F0911) to get the account distributions. It works like a charm and is part of the Report Writing class.

Thanks for the info, it has been really helpful.

After looking at different scenarios, I have been able to figure out how the system works behind the scenes.

If I have any questions, I will definately come back and ask.

The pertinent questions and the expert answers make this post a PERFECT one!
Thank you everybody.

Just wanted to say thanks for the insight.

After about two weeks, today I was finally able to get the bulk of my project done.

Long story short, this is a transparency project, where our AP System and parts of the GL are going to be made available to the public. So they wanted all payments the city I work for made on a given date range but they wanted Cost Center, Account and Sub Account information, so for Non-Purchase Orders I had to go into the GL.

Thanks to research and the insight here, I was able to complete the difficult portion of the project.