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Thread: Offshore development

  1. #1

    Offshore development


    My company is in the midst of a JDE ERP8 purchase, and we know we'll need some modifications to the software before we can use it effectively. From our account rep, it looks like we'll need to mod Sales Order Entry, Invoicing, and Shipment Confirmation right away. The idea of spending $200+ per hour with a consultant is absolutely dead with my management.

    I've head there are companies in India that can do this type of work, but I've got no idea where to look or what type of quality I could expect. Also, are folks like that affiliated with JDE itself? Do they work on their own machine, or mine? Have any of you developer-types been involved in a project where some of the work was offshore? What was your experience with it?

    Any input would be greatly appreciated!

    (Judging from the looks of this community, I think I'm in good hands with our J.D. Edwards selection!)

  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    E Greenville, PA, USA

    Re: Offshore development

    Considering how much you've just shelled out for the pkg,
    is it wise to pinch pennies when modifying 3 of the most important processes?

    P4210, Sales Order Entry is a BEAR. This list has covered that before.

    How extensive are the mods? Will the users go wild once they know it CAN be changed?
    I'm currently adding hundreds of lines of code to address the "now make it do" list.

    As far as quality, there are good coders, and bad coders everywhere.

    As far as logistics, as a developer, I like to be able to sit with the users.
    This gives me the chance to read their eyes, as I describe what I THINK they are asking for.
    Too often, I see the dull stare of a dairy cow. (No offense to any users.)

    What about development questions and answers?
    Try getting an answer from your users NOW.
    Imagine trying to play phone/email tag w/someone in a diff time zone.
    Answers happen a lot faster when that Big$/Hour person is camped at your cubicle.

    Just some things to consider.....
    Back to the future supporting A7.3 while moving to Oracle EBS

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Utah, USA

    Re: Offshore development

    I have to agree with Gene. I am a firm believer in that you get what you pay for. Also, when you work for a company outside the country language can be a huge barrier, communication can sometimes be difficult.

    My guess is that you can find someone for about $160/hr plus expenses. I always recommend at least spending the first week or so onsite to meet the staff, determine reqirements, and create a design for the changes. During the coding phase you cna save some money by letting the developer work remotely and then have him spend the last week on-site to wrap things up. You need to feel good about the person and his skills before allowing him to work remotely though. People can take advantage of you when not on site and charge you for time they never spent.

    When working off-site or on-site the developer will need to work on a deployed workstation that sits on-site. When working remotely he/she will need to connect to your network via VPN and take control of the desktop of the workstation VIA remote control software. VNC, NetMeeting, etc. I do this quite often and it works great!

    If it's a short project (2-3 weeks) then I would have the consultant on-site the entire time. if 4 or more weeks then I would think about allowing some remote work.

    I would recommend that you use someone affiliated with JDE. Working for a JDE business partner I am a little biased in this. One of the advantages of working with a good size consulting firm are the resources available to the individual consultant that will be helping you. I don't always know the answers. Instead of piddling around burning the clients money I can get the answers I need quickly by making a phone call to another consultant in the company that knows the answer. We all work together to help each other out which, in the end, helps the client out.
    Scott Beebe, CPM
    Senior Technical Consultant

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Chicago, IL

    Re: Offshore development

    I also agree with Gene. Last year I was on a project trying to clean up a mess created by the indian off-shore consultants. The company tried to save a few bucks. But in the end it cost them more with lost time, and hiring really expensive consultants to correct all the issues. You do get what you pay for.
    Boris Goldenberg
    JDE Blog

  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2000

    Re: Offshore development

    I was on the same project and I agree.

    Senior Technical Consultant
    17611 E. Tennessee Pl.
    Aurora, CO 80017
    Work 303-337-1906
    Cell 303-885-1405
    Fax 303-306-1800

    Scott B. Whipple
    Technical Consultant
    Current Configuration:
    E1 8.9x SQL Server 200x

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2000

    Re: Offshore development

    make sure to check your private jdelist e-mail !
    SQL 2000 SP1, One World XE Update 7, SP 20 H1, Metaframe XP

  7. #7

    RE: Offshore development

    While I agree that quality does not come cheap, I strongly disagree with
    Boris. I have been to enough sites which have been screwed big time by high
    priced and self proclaimed 'gurus'. You can always find exceptions.

    The essence is that do a due diligence before handing over the work to any
    third party. Check all the credentials and call their previous clients. Do
    not get biased with the location of the consultant or company. A lot of real
    high quality stuff has been done via offshore development with substantial
    savings in cost as compared to JDE consultants (mark my words - it is
    cheaper , not cheap).

    XE 18.1/Oracle 8.1.5/JAS/Optio

    XE 18.1/NT/Oracle 8.1.7

    ERP8/8.11 SP1/Win 2000/JAS/SQL 2000/Oracle 9i/AS400/DB2

  8. #8

    Re: Offshore development

    OK, this is not meant as a blatant promotion, but more as informational. I hope that this thread gets worked up into a frothing boil because it is something that I am really focused on.
    We are a different business model for consulting, and we chose a different path for our outsourcing of development, CNC support, report writing, etc.
    There are many good and some great overseas development houses, but from our experience, this type of outsourcing, while cost effective, is frought with issues.
    Data synchronization, specification management, time differences, language barriers, etc. can really pile up the problems. Don't get me wrong, any remote development gets kudos from us because the money goes to results, not the Hilton and Delta.

    Our methodology uses our iONLINE system using Webex to facilitate our member consultants to access the client machine remotely. Obviously there are a million and a half technologies to provide the remote control, but we decided on Webex for flexibility and ease of use.
    The simple goal was this: Consultants in this country would love the opportunity to develop from home, and all of this development happens on your system, so the need for intense object management and synchronization is eliminated. This also allows the client to meet and handpick their developers, talk with any of them whenever they would like, and see the activity and progress directly. Of course this standard is surrounded by layers Service Level Standards - online project management, onsite meetings, conferences, document control, etc.etc.etc.

    Your user and management population will be thankful not to constantly reiterate their needs and ship revised requirements halfway around the globe...

    I guess the moral to my rant is that there is a plethora of great developers right here in this country that would kill for the opportunity to work remotely, and the bill rates reflect that.

    Tony Brackett
    Board Member
    The I Consortium, Inc.
    Attached Files Attached Files

  9. #9
    New Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2002

    Re: Offshore development

    i agree with what Scott and Gene have said.

    Off-shore development from India can done quite successfully. The things which need to be concerned is the connectivity, time zone and communication. Best thing would be to go for JDE business partner's, you can be assured of the quality and service.

    Siva Kumar.S
    OneWorld XE, SP-20 Update-6
    AS/400, WinNT

  10. #10
    New Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2003

    Re: Offshore development

    To add to Tony’s reply. Firstly there is more than one way of skinning a chicken. While accessing client machine remotely is an option, it’s not the only solution.

    More and more Customers these days are looking for ways and means of sharing object changes and enhancements. This is where products such as Boomerang can help.

    In terms of remote development, we know how slow, expensive and unreliable this can be.There is no need to access the client machine remotely at all. You can make all the changes (even develop a brand new module) on a standalone box and just e-mail it to the client. It’s simple as that.

    On closing we must get this pre conceived notion off our head – India is NOT the only place where remote development can be done. Why not try Australia.

    Marlon Von Hagt
    Ozzyware Pty Ltd
    Melbourne - Australia

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