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Learning curve

bandekar

Member
Hi,

I am an experienced AS/400 World Software developer who is soon going to make a transition to OneWorld Software on AS/400.

I have good knowledge and skills in C++/C due to my CS degree at University, but have never actually worked with it in real life.

I am all excited about the OneWorld. I am asking all of my OneWorld
expert friends at the forum to tell me what skill sets are needed
to be effective in OneWorld.

Please provide me with tips, to learn this software quickly and correctly.I am currently going through OneWorld Developers guide.

Specially I would be interested in knowing how are custom reports written in OneWorld. Is it all done by Report Tool or C++ program
is necessary. Also how are Interactive programs written.

I would appreciate any info, I can get.

Thanks
Shailesh Bandekar
Winnipeg
 

heardl

Member
Bandekar,

What company do you work for, and where is it located? Also are you looking
for OW developers?
 

ProjectRoom

Well Known Member
Re: RE: Learning curve

heardl you forgot to post your CV/Reference and Your expected fee. *g*

Cheers

PR

[ B7.3.3.2 ][ SP 11.3 ][ NT 4.0 ][ AS/400 co-existance ]
 

Zoltan_Gyimesi

Legendary Poster
Hi Shailesh,

First of all, You Are Welcome on the JDEList Forums/Lists.
Here are some tips briefly:

1.) If you have a chance, take a developers course in Denver.
2.) Are you familiar with CNC already? If not, learn a bit CNC to get clear concept about Path Code, Environment, Object Configuration Manager.
3.) Read the Foundation, Development Tools, Enterprise Report Writer documentations (all are on the OW documentation CD).
4.) Use the OW help. Sometimes you can find useful, brief inforamtion there that is not describe elsewhere. To acces this useful help is a bit tricky. Start from OW explorer, Help / Contents. Two new window will pop up. Close the second (Help Topics: OneWorld) which has the input focus. Choose "Tools, Technical and Foundation" from the window.
Select the "OneWorld Tools API Reference". You can find informations about events, system functions, etc.
5.) Browse the Knowledge Garden regulary. I can specially suggest the thematic "Knowledge Browser".
6.) Understand clearly the role of the Data Dictionary and the "Object Concept" of OneWorld.
7.) Post your questions to the Developers Forum :)))

There are some OneWorld guides, created by independent authors. There are announced on the General board of the Forum. Unfortunately we don't have any of them, so I can not tell you how useful are they.

Welcome aboard!

Zoltán

B7332 SP11, ESU 4116422, Intel NT4, SQL 7 SP1
(working with B7321, B7331, XE too)<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by Zoltan_Gyimesi on 8/23/01 11:46 AM.</FONT></P>
 

Frosty the Coder

Legendary Poster
As a "green-screener" with about 7 years of WORLD
I looked very much into getting into OW. Unlike you,
I don't have the C experience.

Both reports and apps can be developed in C or
through the appropriate JDE design tool. We
try to use the tools as much of the product is
designed for use by power users, and we want
to keep the code available to them.

W/in the tools, code is written in EVENT RULES.
Becoming familiar w/ER is somewhat like getting used
to the OLD RPG cycle. ER flows in a certain way,
and if you learn how to flow w/it you can do ok.
W/in the ER, you can still make use of the JDE
tinkertoys (servers) which are now business functions,
and system functions. There are ER for table (file)
io, variable assignments, string manipulation, etc.
Notably MISSING are CASE statements (which can be
replaced by nasty nested IFs) and ARRAY PROCESSING
(which can be worked around by nasty nested string
manipulation).

2 of my major frustrations w/the product are that
I, as a programmer, cannot implement my mods (ie:
MOVOBJ). They get implemented via package builds,
requiring the cooperation of the CNC gods. Another
frustrating point is when a service pack, or cume,
change the way existing code works. Again, this
involves CNC. Zoltan is correct in suggesting
that course.

Supporting users is somewhat different as well.
On the 400, you could WRKJOB and find out which
user is doing what, with which files. I haven't
seen how to do that in OW. Also, a 400 considered
"beefy" for World is probably undersized for OW.

All in all, I as a _PROGRAMMER_ (I still don't
feel comfortable in calling myself a _DEVELOPER_),
I find it challenging on the good days, and
downright disheartening on the bad ones. Perhaps
some of the other RPGers who have made the leap
could post their opinions as well.

Good luck, and make use of "the list". The
OW-wizards on it really know there stuff.

Gene



Gene Piekarski, Jr

AS/400, B733, SP11.2, NT client
AS/400, B733, SP14, W2000 client
XE, SP13
 

Carl_Fisher

Well Known Member
Zoltan - what is the Developers Curse? I assume has already been cast on Xe!



OW733.3 Xe SP 14.2
Enterprise Server - Intel NT + Oracle 8.0.6
Client - Citrix TSE + 4 NT PC's for development
 

Larry_Jones

Legendary Poster
Re: RE: Learning curve

The "OneWorld Developers Curse" (or s/w quality problem) is the natural result of the following dictum from JDE Sales/Marketing/Management:

"Make these applications be all things to all businesses in all business environments, yesterday!"

:0)

Larry Jones
ljones@wagstaff.com
OneWorld XE, SP 15.1
HPUX 11, Oracle SE 8.1.6
Mfg, Distribution, Financials
 

Zoltan_Gyimesi

Legendary Poster
Re: RE: Learning curve

Hi Carl,
Of "Course", I wanted to write "Course" instead of "Curse".
Excuse me, please. I didn't want to offend anybody and anything.
Could be funny to read my spelling mistake (after I checked the meaning of "curse" in my dictionary).

Regards,
Zoltán
P.S.: Now I am a bit irresolute, edit my post on the Forum and correct my mistake or not. Unfortunately the post have been posted on the List and I can not edit that e-mails. OK, I convinced myself, I am going to edit my misspelling.

B7332 SP11, ESU 4116422, Intel NT4, SQL 7 SP1
(working with B7321, B7331, XE too)
 

bandekar

Member
The posts submitted on this topic were very helpful and or funny.
Thanks for submitting them.

It is still few more days before I take up the new position in
Winnipeg, Canada. So I am reading Developers guide, I have started
with first chapter that takes overview of CNC, various tools etc.

Being a AS/400 green screener, everything sounds too good to be true. I cannot help but think, how much is the hype and how much is rooted in truth. I wonder does it increases the complexity for the developers and make his job more difficult. I am keeping my fingers crossed. I guess I will know soon.

Can anyone tell me if they use C or C++ in application development. I know OneWorld have there own Event rules language. How often will I have a need to write code in C/C++. My company is going to Upgrade from World to OneWorld.

This is a great forum and I will actively take part in it.

Regards
Shailesh Bandekar
Sr. Programmer/Analyst (not yet ex- AS/400 green screener)
Winnipeg, Canada
 

Carl_Fisher

Well Known Member
RE: RE: Learning curve

Sorry Zoltan, but I couldn't resist it, some spelling mistakes seem so
right!!



OW733.3 Xe SP 14.2
Enterprise Server - Intel NT + Oracle 8.0.6
Client - Citrix TSE + 4 NT PC's for development
 

Larry_Jones

Legendary Poster
Shailesh,

if you stay within the "OneWorld" environment you have little need to get into 'C' code other than applying SAR fixes (even then you don't have to if you just blindly apply ESUs).

If your future employer wants you to interface directly to third-party applications/systems ... then you may need to get up-to-speed on 'C'.

But the normal JDE Business applications do not require coding in 'C' in my experience. Lets hear what others have to say.

Larry Jones
ljones@wagstaff.com
OneWorld XE, SP 15.1
HPUX 11, Oracle SE 8.1.6
Mfg, Distribution, Financials
 

Zoltan_Gyimesi

Legendary Poster
Shailesh,

Larry is right as usual. I can confirm it and just want to add some situation, when you can (have to?) use C coding:

1.) When you want to use the flexibility of C language instead of the inflexibility of NER language.
2.) There are some cases when you have a minor programing problem but you can not solve it in NER language. Generally simple string manipilations can be an example but there are some more.
3.) When you want to improve the performance of core (critical) part of the code.

Regards,
Zoltán

B7332 SP11, ESU 4116422, Intel NT4, SQL 7 SP1
(working with B7321, B7331, XE too)
 

WhippingBoy

VIP Member
I'll throw in a couple pennies here. . .

If you have ever prayed for humility. . OneWorld is the answer to that prayer.

My background in a nutshell. . 3 years writing World software for JDE corporate, followed by 3 years developing OneWorld, followed by 3 years of consulting for both. And, I still look just like I did the day I graduated High School!

So, here's the deal. . .forget everything you ever knew. You know how S005 ALWAYS has the data validation and S004 ALWAYS does the subfile? And, you know how a bugs location is obvious based on the common subroutines? Well, kiss that intuition good-bye.

ALL the apps are written totally differently, by seemingly unrelated standards. Sure, lots of the stuff LOOKS similar, but under the covers it's Mr Toads Wild Ride. The tool has no arrays, no, subroutines, and no typing (well, almost). Imagine draining your swimming pool with an eye-dropper. . .welcome to programming with the OW tool.

Ok, I'm sorry that sounds bad. In many respects it is . .well, it's frustrating. But, there's hope! In the 3 years I wrote World RPG I became so desperately bored I couldn't believe it. That language just didn't challenge me much. After learning to code OW and dealing with it's limitations I hit the real world and consulting.

Suddenly, there was challenge! Green screen and it's little AS/400 town could never lure me back to it's tranquility. Now there's the Universe of Win32 programming, MFC, Java, APIs up the wazoo, and who knows what else! I've written email generators, Bill of Material exploders, MFC interface dlls, FTP loaders, EDI translaters, and ODBC interfaces. AND, it's not that hard to do.

You already know the programmers mantra "Don't write what you can steal." Well, that's harsh. . .it's actually all FREE on the internet. People just GIVE it away. They want you to have it. All you have to do is find it and decipher it.

So, what's not to like about OW? It's rough to learn because it seems so inconsistent compared to the Sleepy Hollow of RPG, but it's also like learning to type. You were probably faster at pecking with one finger, but as you learned to type properly you blazed away. Well, you'll probably never code as fast as you did in RPG, but you'll be able to create things you never dared attempt. Peel open your head and open your mind to this word "experiment." Odds are you're not going to do most things 'right' on the first try. Stay calm, rethink the issue and go at it from another direction. The easy days of S002 to refresh the screen are behind you, but the excitement of learning fresh, modern ideas and techniques are ahead.

Rome wasn't built in a day. . .first it had to conquer Carthage. OneWorld is now your Carthage. . .beat it and you'll rule the world!

Ok, ok. . I wrote all that cool stuff up there in C and C++. Learn that, even a little, and the real strength of Open Systems is yours for the taking.

Darren Ricciardi - OneWorld Whipping Boy

Looking for work in OR NEAR Amsterdam THE NETHERLANDS
 

WhippingBoy

VIP Member
D'oh. .addendum to that C/C++ comment. I did use the JDE API a lot too. It's powerful and lets you take advantage of the systems built in security features.

Darren Ricciardi - OneWorld Whipping Boy

Looking for work in OR NEAR Amsterdam THE NETHERLANDS
 

Adrian_Chimirel

Legendary Poster
Larry is right, and so is Zoltán, and I personally fail to see any discordance between their oppinions. Is there any?
Hardly waiting for some clues ...



LIVE: B732.1 SP12.2, Oracle 806, FormScape 2.1
SANDBOX: Xe SP15 & Update2, Oracle 8i
RS/6000, Citrix
 
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